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  • GER may be the most powerful ability in jojo, but it probably has a limit? What do you think that limit could be, or do you believe it has no limit at all?

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    • As a Requiem Stand, I think the only limit it has would be when trying to nullify the effects of Heaven Stands.

      Hence why the common theory for Part 6 is that he was protected by the ability, but GER simultaneously could not completely eradicate Made In Heaven's power.

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    • [Golden experience requiem] has no weakness!

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    • I think it could beat made in heaven and nullify its effects. 

      I really do hate the concept of heaven stands.

      IT MAKES LESS SENSE THEN KING CRIMSON TO ME

      SERIOUSLY

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    • Only Stands that could match the power of Gold Experience Requiem are Over Heaven Stands. However, they are not canon, so I shall not include them here. And even they could still be defeated if Giorno got the first punch.

      As for Made in Heaven, it has a weakness that Gold Experience Requiem can explot, and that is that it has both cause and effect, both of which can be nullified by Gold Experience Requiem.

      While Gold Experience Requiem certainly isn't omnipotent, it is without doubt the most powerful Stand in canon universe.

      Oh and, a theory: the Requiem Stands are named like that because a requiem is the last thing you "hear" before you are buried, signifying that it is impossible to survive an encounter with Requiem Stand.

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    • Helel ben Shahaar wrote:
      Only Stands that could match the power of Gold Experience Requiem are Over Heaven Stands. However, they are not canon, so I shall not include them here. And even they could still be defeated if Giorno got the first punch.

      As for Made in Heaven, it has a weakness that Gold Experience Requiem can explot, and that is that it has both cause and effect, both of which can be nullified by Gold Experience Requiem.

      While Gold Experience Requiem certainly isn't omnipotent, it is without doubt the most powerful Stand in canon universe.

      Oh and, a theory: the Requiem Stands are named like that because a requiem is the last thing you "hear" before you are buried, signifying that it is impossible to survive an encounter with Requiem Stand.

      umm.. made in heaven is canon

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    • Thehonestone wrote:
      Helel ben Shahaar wrote:
      Only Stands that could match the power of Gold Experience Requiem are Over Heaven Stands. However, they are not canon, so I shall not include them here. And even they could still be defeated if Giorno got the first punch.

      As for Made in Heaven, it has a weakness that Gold Experience Requiem can explot, and that is that it has both cause and effect, both of which can be nullified by Gold Experience Requiem.

      While Gold Experience Requiem certainly isn't omnipotent, it is without doubt the most powerful Stand in canon universe.

      Oh and, a theory: the Requiem Stands are named like that because a requiem is the last thing you "hear" before you are buried, signifying that it is impossible to survive an encounter with Requiem Stand.

      umm.. made in heaven is canon

      When I said Over Heaven Stands I was refering to The World Over Heaven and Star Platinum Over Heaven.

      I am well aware that Made in Heaven is canon (Stone Ocean is my 2nd favourite part), but I don't think it classifies as Over Heaven Stand.

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    • Helel ben Shahaar wrote:
      Thehonestone wrote:
      Helel ben Shahaar wrote:
      Only Stands that could match the power of Gold Experience Requiem are Over Heaven Stands. However, they are not canon, so I shall not include them here. And even they could still be defeated if Giorno got the first punch.

      As for Made in Heaven, it has a weakness that Gold Experience Requiem can explot, and that is that it has both cause and effect, both of which can be nullified by Gold Experience Requiem.

      While Gold Experience Requiem certainly isn't omnipotent, it is without doubt the most powerful Stand in canon universe.

      Oh and, a theory: the Requiem Stands are named like that because a requiem is the last thing you "hear" before you are buried, signifying that it is impossible to survive an encounter with Requiem Stand.

      umm.. made in heaven is canon
      When I said Over Heaven Stands I was refering to The World Over Heaven and Star Platinum Over Heaven.

      I am well aware that Made in Heaven is canon (Stone Ocean is my 2nd favourite part), but I don't think it classifies as Over Heaven Stand.

      Any stand that has evolved to its most powerful form, as both TWOH and MiH have, is classified as an 'Over Heaven' stand, or at least it should be.

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    • I mean, imagine GEOH

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    • It's been discussed a lot before and the consensus is that, for anyone to stand a chance against GER they have to be immune to the flow of time; acausal. The only Stand that can do something like that is Tusk Act 4, and in a battle vs Giorno Johnny would never in a million years be able to activate it.

      Off the top of my head, the only one that stalemates GER is Notorious BIG since it can't die, yet it simultaneously can't harm Giorno either. (I guess Magenta Magenta would count for that too looool)

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    • well, the only stand known that defeated GER is the world over heaven

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    • Ways to beat GER:

      As already mentioned, be an acausal being, one who transcends cause and effect.

      Brute force it, not in the regular sense of punch punch, but in the sense of just simply having stronger control over time or reality as a whole, this is how TWOH beat it.

      Have one of the true bullshit abilities like conceptual manipulation, boundary manipulation, definition manipulation, ability manipulation, and other such meta abilties.

      Finally being a higher-dimensional being, an X-dimensional being is a level of existence above an X-1-dimensional being, they transcend it's comprehension, exist on a seperate plane, are an uncountably infinite amount bigger, and essentially view it as fiction.

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    • Actually,since ger only has control over actions,can't giorno be killed by a natural effect?ex:(tidal waves),(earthquakes),(radiation)etc.

      seems unlikely but also simple

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    • Epiccheev wrote:
      Actually,since ger only has control over actions,can't giorno be killed by a natural effect?ex:(tidal waves),(earthquakes),(radiation)etc.

      seems unlikely but also simple

      I don't think so, because even things like that need a certain action to get them up and running. 

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    • tusk act 4 is a thing.

      it not just transends cause and effect, but time and space as a whole.

      also, you cant reduce infinity to zero. 

      I dont think it would be able to beat GER

      but this would happen:

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WCi_s-vKNBI

      forever

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    • Thehonestone wrote:
      tusk act 4 is a thing.

      it not just transends cause and effect, but time and space as a whole.

      also, you cant reduce infinity to zero. 

      I dont think it would be able to beat GER

      but this would happen:

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WCi_s-vKNBI

      forever

      I want to scream.

      Tusk doesn't transcend cause and effect, if it was it would never take harm, never be injured by it's own attacks, it would be completely invincible, yet it got it's ass handed to it by Diego, who harmed him, if Tusk transcended space and time it would be beyond all comprehension, it could be anywhere and everywhere in space and time, and exist out of it entirely, and it couldn't be harmed by anything as it transcends it all.

      "You can't reduce infinity to zero" is one of the worst arguments i've ever seen, but people use it so much, infinite damage doesn't transcend effect nullification, GER isn't making things zero in that sense, he's making it so things have no results, the infinite spin doesn't happen, Johnny doesn't even shoot his finger nails, he doesn't breathe nor have his hear beat.

      GER>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Tusk Act 4.

      The Tusk Act 4 wank has to stop, it's strong as hell but only #4 (Fittingly enough) in terms of the strongest stands.

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    • Zengenbenlendenwhen wrote:
      Thehonestone wrote:
      tusk act 4 is a thing.

      it not just transends cause and effect, but time and space as a whole.

      also, you cant reduce infinity to zero. 

      I dont think it would be able to beat GER

      but this would happen:

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WCi_s-vKNBI

      forever

      I want to scream.

      Tusk doesn't transcend cause and effect, if it was it would never take harm, never be injured by it's own attacks, it would be completely invincible, yet it got it's ass handed to it by Diego, who harmed him, if Tusk transcended space and time it would be beyond all comprehension, it could be anywhere and everywhere in space and time, and exist out of it entirely, and it couldn't be harmed by anything as it transcends it all.

      "You can't reduce infinity to zero" is one of the worst arguments i've ever seen, but people use it so much, infinite damage doesn't transcend effect nullification, GER isn't making things zero in that sense, he's making it so things have no results, the infinite spin doesn't happen, Johnny doesn't even shoot his finger nails, he doesn't breathe nor have his hear beat.

      GER>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Tusk Act 4.

      The Tusk Act 4 wank has to stop, it's strong as hell but only #4 (Fittingly enough) in terms of the strongest stands.

      is there any stand that can beat GER?

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    • is there any stand that can beat GER?

      Nope.

      The World Over Heaven could; and all those bizarre2 Kars Stands that exist in Jorge Joestar novel. But seeing that none of them are canon, and so they de facto do not exist, no.

      Gold Experience Requiem is the ultimate Stand.

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    • Helel ben Shahaar wrote:

      is there any stand that can beat GER?

      Nope.

      The World Over Heaven could; and all those bizarre2 Kars Stands that exist in Jorge Joestar novel. But seeing that none of them are canon, and so they de facto do not exist, no.

      Gold Experience Requiem is the ultimate Stand.

      what if i stabbed thunderstruck (my stand) with the arrow, and my biggest desire was to beat GER no matter what. what could counter its power?

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    • Thehonestone wrote:
      Helel ben Shahaar wrote:

      is there any stand that can beat GER?

      Nope.

      The World Over Heaven could; and all those bizarre2 Kars Stands that exist in Jorge Joestar novel. But seeing that none of them are canon, and so they de facto do not exist, no.

      Gold Experience Requiem is the ultimate Stand.

      what if i stabbed thunderstruck (my stand) with the arrow, and my biggest desire was to beat GER no matter what. what could counter its power?

      If that was the case, my Stand, Wheel Requiem could beat yours without even blinking. Fan-made Stands are even less acceptable in this situation than non-canon Stands. 

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    • Helel ben Shahaar wrote:
      Thehonestone wrote:
      Helel ben Shahaar wrote:

      is there any stand that can beat GER?

      Nope.

      The World Over Heaven could; and all those bizarre2 Kars Stands that exist in Jorge Joestar novel. But seeing that none of them are canon, and so they de facto do not exist, no.

      Gold Experience Requiem is the ultimate Stand.

      what if i stabbed thunderstruck (my stand) with the arrow, and my biggest desire was to beat GER no matter what. what could counter its power?
      If that was the case, my Stand, Wheel Requiem could beat yours without even blinking. Fan-made Stands are even less acceptable in this situation than non-canon Stands. 

      I guess

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    • Thehonestone wrote:
      Helel ben Shahaar wrote:

      is there any stand that can beat GER?

      Nope.

      The World Over Heaven could; and all those bizarre2 Kars Stands that exist in Jorge Joestar novel. But seeing that none of them are canon, and so they de facto do not exist, no.

      Gold Experience Requiem is the ultimate Stand.

      what if i stabbed thunderstruck (my stand) with the arrow, and my biggest desire was to beat GER no matter what. what could counter its power?

      This thread already has ways listed to counter GER, so you can reread the thread.

      If you want some definitive, specific powers that counter effect nullification/return to zero:

      -Acausal: This has been gone over 10,000 times in this thread, so no explanation needed anymore.

      -Strong reality warping: Effect nullficiation is essentially the strongest time-manipulation ability, so going a step above into full reality warping is the next step, but even then a certian level is required, as warping reality isn't by defualt stronger than casuality manipulation just because it contains it, in the same way a person who manipulates the 4 classic elements isn't by defualt stronger than someone who only controls fire. A specific example of how a strong reality warper might beat GER: GER uses effect nullification, the reality warper nullifies the nullification (Directed by Christopher Nolan) as it is one small asset of reality, and writes GER out of existence.


      -Truth manipulation: This is a large part of reality warping and one of it's strongest assets, an amazing ability that actually isn't limited to space or time, TWOH's reality warping is actually focused on this. Example: GER uses nullficiation, Truth Manipulator changes the truth to "GER doesn't use nullfication" and "GER is dead". Once again a certian level is still needed.


      -Boundary manipulation: Now we get into the crazy shit, powers that can go a step beyond reality warping, by controlling the boundaries that seperate everything you can pull off some crazy conceptual-level stuff. GER nullifies shitsies, the boundary manipulator erases the boundary between GER's ability and dieing, so GER actually just killed itself.


      -Higher-dimensional manipulation: This is an automatic win and doesn't really even count, though a significantly strong truth or boundary manipulator could potentially push themselves to these levels if they're not already there.


      -Conceptual manipulation: There are many other conceptual abilities like above with boundaries, such as manipulation of logic/non-logic, definition, perspective, or even abilites and powers, so we'll just get to the main one: Conceptual manipulation is the power to manipulate concepts (Who'd have guessed), which includes: Space, time, reality, beyond space, time, and reality, life, death, existence, non-existence, duality, God, good, bad, bouje, the concept of someone (The concept of GER), the concept of concepts, strength, logic, possibility, impossibility, truth, fiction, limits, infinity, beyond infinity, etc. etc. etc requiem over heaven act 12. Conceptual manipulation essentially means you control everything, at least that we can think of, because anything imagined or done is a concept in some way, "beyond concepts" is a goddamn concept. Albiet once you get to this level consistency and sense are no longer a thing, though they are concepts, but you could still say some shit about "beyond concepts" or maybe the only thing like that is omnipotence, which is a giant middle finger to everything ever.

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    • Zengenbenlendenwhen wrote:
      Thehonestone wrote:
      Helel ben Shahaar wrote:

      is there any stand that can beat GER?

      Nope.

      The World Over Heaven could; and all those bizarre2 Kars Stands that exist in Jorge Joestar novel. But seeing that none of them are canon, and so they de facto do not exist, no.

      Gold Experience Requiem is the ultimate Stand.

      what if i stabbed thunderstruck (my stand) with the arrow, and my biggest desire was to beat GER no matter what. what could counter its power?
      This thread already has ways listed to counter GER, so you can reread the thread.

      If you want some definitive, specific powers that counter effect nullification/return to zero:

      -Acausal: This has been gone over 10,000 times in this thread, so no explanation needed anymore.

      -Strong reality warping: Effect nullficiation is essentially the strongest time-manipulation ability, so going a step above into full reality warping is the next step, but even then a certian level is required, as warping reality isn't by defualt stronger than casuality manipulation just because it contains it, in the same way a person who manipulates the 4 classic elements isn't by defualt stronger than someone who only controls fire. A specific example of how a strong reality warper might beat GER: GER uses effect nullification, the reality warper nullifies the nullification (Directed by Christopher Nolan) as it is one small asset of reality, and writes GER out of existence.


      -Truth manipulation: This is a large part of reality warping and one of it's strongest assets, an amazing ability that actually isn't limited to space or time, TWOH's reality warping is actually focused on this. Example: GER uses nullficiation, Truth Manipulator changes the truth to "GER doesn't use nullfication" and "GER is dead". Once again a certian level is still needed.


      -Boundary manipulation: Now we get into the crazy shit, powers that can go a step beyond reality warping, by controlling the boundaries that seperate everything you can pull off some crazy conceptual-level stuff. GER nullifies shitsies, the boundary manipulator erases the boundary between GER's ability and dieing, so GER actually just killed itself.


      -Higher-dimensional manipulation: This is an automatic win and doesn't really even count, though a significantly strong truth or boundary manipulator could potentially push themselves to these levels if they're not already there.


      -Conceptual manipulation: There are many other conceptual abilities like above with boundaries, such as manipulation of logic/non-logic, definition, perspective, or even abilites and powers, so we'll just get to the main one: Conceptual manipulation is the power to manipulate concepts (Who'd have guessed), which includes: Space, time, reality, beyond space, time, and reality, life, death, existence, non-existence, duality, God, good, bad, bouje, the concept of someone (The concept of GER), the concept of concepts, strength, logic, possibility, impossibility, truth, fiction, limits, infinity, beyond infinity, etc. etc. etc requiem over heaven act 12. Conceptual manipulation essentially means you control everything, at least that we can think of, because anything imagined or done is a concept in some way, "beyond concepts" is a goddamn concept. Albiet once you get to this level consistency and sense are no longer a thing, though they are concepts, but you could still say some shit about "beyond concepts" or maybe the only thing like that is omnipotence, which is a giant middle finger to everything ever.

      cool beans

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    • This is video game only so take it with a pinch of salt but supposedly Bites The Dust time loop effect can return time to before it was a requiem stand to begin with.

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    • It can but Hayato has to hit the opponent and he's very slow, plus I don't think it can be comboed so you can't guarantee it. 

      On another video game note, the way GER's ability is portrayed is that a large sphere of black/green instantly warps any action back to zero, right? In EoH's cutscene where they run into HA DIO, for whatever reason Giorno decides to meet DIO's fist with his own which causes TWOH to overwrite GER's activation. That's all fine and makes sense, except why was Giorno so stupid to rush attack him instead of using his ultimate defense to stalemate DIO? Because videogames, because they wanted a cool moment.

      It's established that HA DIO has to actually touch something with his hands to overwrite it, which he wouldn't have been able to do had Giorno just stood there and cockblocked him.

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    • When I stop to thing about it I wonder if GER is as broken as we are lead to believe. On one hand it's true that nobody can destroy it, but on the other hand in MOST CASES I doubt it can destroy anybody either. Think about it, it's abilty negates effect which means most people hit by it would would return to the state they were in BEFORE they were in. The only reason Diavolo got trapped in an infinate loop was because his King Crimson negated/erased effect. As such he couldn't had no state to return to. As a result Diavolo became stuck in a paradoxical loop from which there is no escape.

      At least that's my theory. What's your thought's on it.

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    • Animalia555 wrote:
      When I stop to thing about it I wonder if GER is as broken as we are lead to believe. On one hand it's true that nobody can destroy it, but on the other hand in MOST CASES I doubt it can destroy anybody either. Think about it, it's abilty negates effect which means most people hit by it would would return to the state they were in BEFORE they were in. The only reason Diavolo got trapped in an infinate loop was because his King Crimson negated/erased effect. As such he couldn't had no state to return to. As a result Diavolo became stuck in a paradoxical loop from which there is no escape.

      At least that's my theory. What's your thought's on it.

      Things that are effects of something:

      -Breathing

      -Your heart beating

      -Your brain sending signals

      Yes GER can kill you with its ability.

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    • Wait here's some I realised, I think I saw someone bring this up another time but I can't remember where. So Requiuem stands are made to give the users what they need at the moment and time, Giorno needed something to counter King Crimsons ability and beat Diavolo, he got it. So now thats that done, does technically mean GER could get beaten by other opponents after that who aren't Diavolo.

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    • That's just a fan theory, nothing more. The first time Polnareff's Requiem activated it was during a totally calm, non-combative moment in time, as he reached behind his cabinet to retrieve the arrow. It had the same sleeping and soul switching abilities then as it does during the final battle.

      The "what the user desires" part of it is interpreted as Requiem defending the arrow and trying to get away from the scene. It doesn't have any influence on its actual abilities.

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    • Thehonestone wrote:
      Helel ben Shahaar wrote:

      is there any stand that can beat GER?

      Nope.

      The World Over Heaven could; and all those bizarre2 Kars Stands that exist in Jorge Joestar novel. But seeing that none of them are canon, and so they de facto do not exist, no.

      Gold Experience Requiem is the ultimate Stand.

      what if i stabbed thunderstruck (my stand) with the arrow, and my biggest desire was to beat GER no matter what. what could counter its power?

      I assume you mean 'What would happen if a Requiem stand with the purpose of defeating GER was created'?

      I would guess it would get a stand ability in line with reality manipulation, to be able to manipulate the reality manipulated by GER or something.

      Idk really

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    • Delivers wrote:
      Wait here's some I realised, I think I saw someone bring this up another time but I can't remember where. So Requiuem stands are made to give the users what they need at the moment and time, Giorno needed something to counter King Crimsons ability and beat Diavolo, he got it. So now thats that done, does technically mean GER could get beaten by other opponents after that who aren't Diavolo.

      No. The stand is given a power capable of completing the desire the user had at the time the Requiem stand was pierced, but it then retains those abilities and will work the same for every other stand.

      Hence: GER is nigh-invincible (omnipotent beings would still win... but they don't exist in JoJo so yeah)

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    • Animalia555 wrote:
      This is video game only so take it with a pinch of salt but supposedly Bites The Dust time loop effect can return time to before it was a requiem stand to begin with.

      It would work if three factors were met:

      1. Kira must already have Bites The Dust set up, otherwise it'll not be able to activate.

      2. If GER activates at the same moment it'll nullify the action of Bites The Dust, which means that Kira would have to make sure that GER doesn't activate.

      3. It must happen within one hour since the creation of GER

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